Do you know how many production cars are built today with pop-up headlights? My research indicates that the numbers are in the low zeros with little chance of that changing in the near future. That’s the result of aerodynamic headlights becoming ubiquitous everywhere and the requirement for daytime running lights showing up here and there. And it’s a damn shame too because, well to be honest most of us love cars with headlights that go up and down.
We also like headlights that hide behind clever grille textured doors and those like on the classic Opel GT that roll over Beethoven. Mostly though we like the ones that pop up when needed, and then drop down when the sun is around to get the job done.
Why the heck is that? What is it about pop-up headlights that makes the NA Miata so much more desirable to many than its successors? What’s your reasoning behind this phenomenon: why do we love pop-up headlights?
Image: APIDAOnline
Hooniverse Asks: Why are Pop-up Headlights So Dang Cool?
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80 responses to “Hooniverse Asks: Why are Pop-up Headlights So Dang Cool?”
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Because they almost let the designer do whatever they want with the sheet metal.
Do these count as pop ups? Are they just hidden? The grille does actually pop up out of the way… Whatever they are, they’re cool.
http://www.thisweekinmotors.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/09/charger.jpg-
Through-the-help-of-3rd-party-auto-parts-developers, GM answered Trans-Am fans’ prayers of wanting a tribute to the Smokey and Knight Rider car as a conversion for the 5th-and-6th-generation Camaro by replicating the 2nd-and-3rd-generation F-Birds’ signature front ends. The move is a welcome one since the Camaro, Corvette, and Firebird are all made by General Motors.
For the-5th-generation-Camaro, the 2nd-gen Firebird facade replicates the look of the Trans-Am seen in the first two Burt Reynolds Smokey-And-The-Bandit films with its V-shaped split grille and flush headlight covers.
For-the-6th-generation-Camaro, the 3rd-gen Firebird facade accurately replicates the look of the Knight Rider and SATB-3 wedge-shaped bumper except that the headlights for the remake are hidden behind movable rectangular side grille panels in the style of competitor muscle cars like the Chrysler Charger/Challenger or Ford Torino/Mustang instead of the original square pop-up units located under the corners of the hood as seen in the 4th-and-5th-generation (1984-to-2004) Corvettes.
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I’m pretty sure the European pedestrian safety standards were the primary reason behind the demise of pop-up headlights. Darn bureaucrats!
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Because nostalgia. I’m not being flippant — that’s really what makes them cooler now than they were then. Like 8-bit computers and cartoon tobacco mascots, they are something close enough in the past to remember vividly, but now (thanks to Euro pedestrian safety regs) truly gone forever.
http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-qjch71mYIf0/TeRKp5O-JeI/AAAAAAAAACk/wn0KFC12Tm4/s1600/323F.jpg-
Exactly, nostalgia. I like them the way I like automatic antennas, illuminated ash trays, and cat-less engines. A careless time, when you would smoke, drink, drive, and fornicate without worrying too much about consequences.
I know that the 70ies and 80ies weren’t trouble free, but that’s what nostalgia does to memories.-
I was just talking to a co-worker yesterday morning about the K.C. Royals’ souvenir halter top giveaways at the ballpark in the 1970s. The club made a big hullabaloo a couple of years ago about bringing back the “notorious” promotion, but in the end the new “halters” turned out to be rather tame, basically ladies’ tank tops. Many local pundits noted that for all our supposed decent into moral anarchy, corporate advocacy of the original style would no longer be socially acceptable in the 21st century.
https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/513471d6d92fa5acf5e7cc4e22532a02518abee7f1da7fdb9818173f268015dd.jpg
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Pretty sure Euro regs were only partly to blame. Another thing that hastened their demise was that the technology arose to make headlamps in any shape imaginable, so pop up headlamps had no aerodynamic or stylistic benefit. Indeed they acted as an airbrake when deployed.
Doesn’t stop me missing them.-
I think the regs were the nail that will keep their coffin shut forever, regardless of how much a design team would like to bring them back.
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That plus cost. Moving headlights = more parts = more cost. Save 50c per car and you’re talking real money!
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I gotta go the other way… pop ups are cool when they aren’t:
http://www.deutschnine.com/rennlist/gts-headlight-kits/patrick-gavin-porsche-944-turbo.jpg
http://www.c5racer.com/catalog/images/C5RLights-1.jpg
http://i668.photobucket.com/albums/vv43/Nik_da_Greek/My%20new%20RX%207%20version%20one/DSCF1543.jpg-
The Porsche reminds me of a crossed-eyed cat peering at someone’s breakfast from tabletop edge just before snatching the bacon off their plate.
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That may not be the best angle. It may be a home-brew.
http://sportwagen.online.fr/images/924/924carreragtr.jpg-
May be, but werks-Röhrl had something very simliar:
http://i.wheelsage.org/pictures/porsche/924/porsche_924_carrera_gts_rallye_1.jpg -
No, no, the first one was fine. I love cats and that angle gives it a sneaky “I’m gonna git you, sucka!” look to it.
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As a founding member of the 401st Pop-Up Headlight Union, I can tell you that pop up headlights are cool because they have been abandoned by automakers. Because they hearken back to a day when big government was matched by engineering prowess. Pop ups were on some of the greatest cars ever produced…
https://s3.amazonaws.com/static.carthrottle.com/workspace/uploads/memes/ferrari-f40-inspired-harley-da-54b3f73033e1b.jpg
…and yet were also on more attainable cars.
http://www.curbsideclassic.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/04/4-20-2012-011.jpg-
Hey, hey! Are you implying that the Prelude wasn’t among the greatest cars ever produced?
Also, don’t forget that really mass-market Hondas had them, too.
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-BpEKlOpOElU/TaLgUjiuOaI/AAAAAAAABtI/3lP0VyABgOQ/s1600/Honda-Accord-Sedan-1986.jpg
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You could purposefully break them and to make them “cooler”.
http://i35.tinypic.com/15nox6w.jpg-
Stoned Nissan is stoned.
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Pop up lights are cool because they allow cars with mandated sealed beam headlights to not look like disney characters full time. They’re also cool because you can pop in DOT approved LED conversions that kick ass. I’m tired of people swearing that their hid/led H4 conversions must be good because people don’t honk at em… I love my truck lites, though admittedly from the front when they are on the car looks even more like some sort of disney character, thanks to the popups though when they are down I still get confused with that tofu toting anime drifter. Stupid white and black toyota. Bonus points for the motorcycle popups, some day i will own one.
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“…you can pop in DOT approved LED conversions that kick ass.”
I’m Tanshanomi and I approve this message.
http://hooniverse.info/wp-content/uploads/2012/12/Wide-Pop-Up-Static-cropped.jpg-
Nights and day difference, I mean night turns to day basically hehe
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Night-Turns-To-Day? Sounds like the 2008 remake of Knight Rider wherein Mike Traceur takes over from his father Michael Long-Knight’s job of battling monsters-of-the-week with a Shelby Mustang instead of the obsolete Pontiac Trans-Am. If the remake used the 5th-generation Camaro as Hasbro did for the Transformers Movie Universe, the KR remake could’ve reached the same multi-season sell-value as its parent series while retaining the monster-of-the-week vibe, but flaws in the script such as Traceur’s shallow characterization as simply the son of the legendary Michael Long doomed the remake to failure after one season.
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Are you saying that hid/led H4 conversions are good or bad? Since both my cars have sealed-beam headlights I was thinking about getting some kind of LED conversion, but the GE bulbs are $200+ per bulb!
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LED > HID by far.
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LED ‘bulbs’ that fit into a H4 halogen bulbs place are also available now, but thus far not very cheap. (But cheaper than HID and no mucking about with high voltages and balllasts etc) eg 3800 lumen. http://www.cyclopsadventuresports.com/3800-Lumen-H4-LED-Headlight-bulb-_p_83.html Yes they work in cars too. See also http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?t=1455474. I have some in one of my W124s and they are better than HID. No UV output and low heat means they’re kinder on the headlights plastic content as well as the vibration resistance and long life of LEDs. If you want to uprate your plastic lensed H4 fitment headlights they are also a much better choice than uprated (hotter) halogens.
http://www.cyclopsadventuresports.com/assets/images/20150123-cyclops-065_blk.jpg-
We have yet to test any retrofit that actually meets DOT photometric requirements when installed in a vehicle.
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Any H4 halogen bulbs in actual euro spec headlights as seen outside the USA,(eg: in my W124s or Citoen BX & CX or Lancia Gamma or Renault Espace) don’t meet DOT requirements either as they have a much sharper low beam cut-off. I find these LED ‘bulbs’ to be just like halogen bulbs but with more light, but, like H4 halogens, no, they won’t descend to meeting DOT requirements.
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Euro spec has nothing to do with it. When you put an LED light source in front of a reflector tailored to an incandescent bulb, it’s not going to give a suitable pattern. Period.
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These are very newly available and the products are changing constantly, that’s why I put up the link to the Pistonheads discussion. But if you model the placement of the led(s) to be in the same place as the light scource of glowing coiled wire in a standard halogen bulb, it will have the same optics.
Despite my strong initial scepticism based on experience with earlier automotive leds, this is what I have found on my H4 fitment on my W124 which has a large reflector and a focusing lens. Just like a halogen bulb, with the same focusing and beam cut-off but with HID levels of light output, and better focusing than a 120W/90W H4 bulb with it’s overlength filament. I fitted the LED ‘bulbs’ a month ago.
I believe these are the future of lighting in the same way as LEDs have become in architectural lighting.
As for legality, we have six monthly warrant of fitness checks here, and the car passed straight away, unlike HIDs which are not allowed if they weren’t available as original fitment and which are easily spotted by the bulky ballasts giving them away.
http://www.alibaba.com/product-detail/IP68-All-in-one-12v-24v_1801393588.html
http://www.hidlighting.com.au/images/led-headlight-replacement-bulb-h4-5×5.jpg
http://www.fz09.org/forum/attachments/6125d1402058678-led-headlight-kit-h4_headlight2__46926.1400089337.1280.1280.jpg
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Dot approved either is good. The replacement LED housings are a complete package that rules. Hid’s are good in housings designed for them, but they don’t make any good pre made sealed beam projector conversion housings so you end up custom making something yourself to do it right and come in almost as expensive as the leds. Best bang for buck is some hella e code housings with decent h4 halogen bulbs, can come in under 100 bucks if you shop around. IMO truck lite leds are worth the money, they use less power and are generally a direct swap. http://www.danielsternlighting.com/tech/bulbs/Hid/conversions/conversions.html
Early Two-wheeled Tuesday answer. Suzuki GSX 750 ES3 Katana
http://13252-presscdn-0-94.pagely.netdna-cdn.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/06/3213-620×465.jpg
http://www.motorcyclespecs.co.za/Gallery%20%20A/Suzuki%20VS750GL%2086.jpg
http://13252-presscdn-0-94.pagely.netdna-cdn.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/06/3210-620×465.jpg
Using the running gear of the GSX 750 ESD, but with hydraulic clutch and slightly larger valves for more power – and the pop-up headlight to make it the most ‘police-radar proof’ vehicle I’ve ever been in/on. Both these 750s are very reliable as long as you swap out the stupid factory voltage regulator/rectifier for one from a CX400/500/650 Honda. I had 400,000 km on one of mine. These were also much quicker than the first 16 valve Suzi 750s, nearly as quick as the later (first) GSXR 750s
http://www.suzukicycles.org/photos/GS/GS750ES-brochures/1986_GS750ES_CANsales13_800.jpg
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i rode my friends GSX750EF (same as above but with full fairing) and was scarily surprised how fast it was – pulled 210kmh no problems. luckily its owner was in hospital with viral meningitis so he wasn’t around to see me do so or complain about it
not as fast as my (then owned) GSX1100ET but way smoother-
Once, when it was stolen, a police helicopter chased my bike and estimated it at 240 km/h. Luckily the pursuit was successful and I got it back. That was quite a story.
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Knight Biker, a shadowy flight into the dangerous world of a biker who does not exist
Jack Darby, a young loner on a mission to champion the cause of the innocent, the helpless, the powerless in a world of criminals who operate above the law.
Pop-up headlights?
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I think you mean propped-up headlights. Such a happy car!
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The Sprite was supposed to have pop up lights but luckily didn’t.
Then there’s this:
http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-4_qDAXvpTCY/UWFsbVWv6HI/AAAAAAAAMvo/_3X3LohVP8Q/s1600/Miatapalooza+042a.jpg-
That reminds me of the Maxton Rollerskate.
http://www.maxtonrollerskate.com/car/maxton/maxton_rollerskate_1.jpg -
But if you like that look, just leave your Porsche 928 headlights up.
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploads19/Porsche+928+Lights+Up1327116809.jpg-
Night Glider, a shadowy flight into the dangerous world of a pony who does not exist.
Night Glider, a young loner on a crusade to champion the cause of the innocent, the helpless, and the powerless, in a world of criminals who operate above the law.
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If the condition lasts more than 4 hours, please consult a physician.
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It’s very hard to keep from being sucked by that happy little face.
MUST. RESIST. BUGEYE. SPRITE.-
I really wanted one as a kid, and I still do. As a kid I would order Moss Motors catalogs and scheme about how I would modify one or figure out if I could afford to build one by buying components individually.
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I know I’ll catch flak for this, but I’ve never really liked pop up headlights.
Hide away lights – like the first gen Camaro RS, or the Charger that pj134 posted are waaayyyy cool, but I don’t have the same feeling for pop up lights. Even the most holy of holy Miura looks weird to me when the lights are on. The only pop up lights I can come up with that are ok in my book are C2 ‘Vettes.
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If you don’t care for the Miura then you probably aren’t wild about the Porsche 928 either. I do find pop-ups nostalgic (former 1st-gen Integra owner here) but I have no great wish for them to return either.
Because they are such an easy and foolproof way to achieve what we deep down want most of all: getting seen by non-car people for our car.
Without hidden headlights you’d never have strange/cool fronts like on this DeSoto.
We have a nice mix of youngsters and oldies commenting here. I wonder if the younger folks have the same feelings about pop-up headlights as the middle-aged and older. For anyone who was a kid when Gerald Ford fell down the air stairs, pop-up headlights were associated with the iconic vehicles of the time. If you grew up after they went out of vogue, are they still evocative?
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Who are you calling middle aged?!
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I’m 17, and I do enjoy pop-up headlights.
I like pop-up headlights so much that they were a deciding factor in buying my snowmobile.
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That almost makes me want to move where it snows, almost.
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Why do you need snow?
(This is just mocked up. The wheels replace the skis.)
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Because even when they don’t work quite right, you still love them… https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zvc9M9aMT38
From an ownership standpoint, they’re a mixed bag. I loved them on my AW11; not only did they look perfect, but they allowed the use of larger and more powerful lights than would normally be possible on a 1980s car of that size.
On my Miata, they were a disaster. They made the front of the car wander at highway speeds when deployed, with a corresponding drop in fuel economy (it was a 1.6, so it dropped from 40 to 35ish, but still), the low beams were pathetic and the high beams were barely adequate. To add insult to injury, they made the car look stoned when retracted and surprised when up.
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My ’90 with 211K on it still tracks dead true with the lights up or down. I have never noticed a degradation in fuel economy, either, although I suppose it may drop a tad. I also know of no one who has ever gotten 40 MPG highway with one. I rarely, exceed high 20s on the road, low 20s around town. Was yours a diesel?…
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Mine was a ’90 as well, with 250k on it. It was de-catted, fitted with a ’97 gearbox and (functional!) VLSD, and lowered to frame-scraping height. I never put the roof down because it was embarrassingly loud (the de-cat was done by the previous owner, I take full responsibility for the lowering, and would do it again). No idea why there would be such a disparity in highway mileage, mine got low 20s around town too.
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Wow. That is epic mileage. But i would suggest that perhaps your Miata was more susceptible to crosswinds due to the suspension mods.
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That’s a distinct possibility, the change from ~0.5* to 2* of camber would certainly have some effect on stability. Either way there was a distinct change in straight line stability when the headlights were raised.
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I could hear the wind noise on my Fiero when I put the headlights up. Interesting to hear pop ups hinder handling and mpg when up too !
Because in my old pre-safety conscious era Elan, while cresting a hill under full throttle the lights lose their vacuum and start to recede. It is cool to test your nerve to see if you lift.
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Don’t lift, the vacuum will weaken at lower revs!
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Less throttle, more vacuum, lights pop back up. Yea I chicken out. Had the same issue with the wipers on my 59 Ford. Less wipes under throttle.
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“Less throttle, more vacuum” – huh, I don’t understand vacuum.
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from https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Manifold_vacuum
“When the throttle is opened, ambient air is free to fill the intake manifold, increasing the pressure (filling the vacuum)…”
To me that means there is less vacuum. A vacuum gauge would read less in/Hq -
Right! I totally forgot that the cause for the vacuum is that precious, shiny air pump after the throttle body, not some obscure Venturi or Venetian effect or something. Another mystery solved in the Hooniverse, thanks!
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If in doubt, flat out.
I suspect something that helps pop-ups heavily, is that they’re mostly associated with cool cars. If there were scads of ’92 Buick Centuries or something running around with one pop-up headlight permanently stuck open, we might not think of them as quite so cool.
But, since they’re mostly associated with rad wedgy 80s sports cars, they’re perma-cool.
Because you can do things like this.
http://pic.armedcats.net/l/la/labcoatguy/2015/10/19/R0011174.JPG
Why? Because sometimes you gotta say what the f*ck!
http://media.liveauctiongroup.net/i/13256/13427770_4.jpg?v=8CF3C9738EA3290
Another reason, turning on the lights makes cool mechanical things happen, and aren’t cars all about cool mechanical things happening?
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Excellent vid, thanks for posting it
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Did I miss the Honda Accord, or are they even rarer than Jalpas?
Edit: no criticism, genuine question.-
He’s missing a few things, didn’t spot any Celicas either.
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Because it’s a fleeting thing. When one inevitably fails it will look really dumb.
They’re a good place to add some style.
Also the MR2 had them and it is a well-known fact that that is the best car ever made.
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Yeah but that weird conversion looks weird, post up stock style i can drool over please.
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or post up the correct generation of MR2 at least 😛
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All these are pretty good, but like the lead image, four 4″x6″ FTW!!!!!!!!!!
Sure, it’s not like you can drive it for more than 30 seconds without an electrical fire, but hey!!!
http://i72.photobucket.com/albums/i188/dburdyshaw/Vehicles%202/1986_Aston_Martin_Lagonda.jpg
Just because.
[video src="https://vid194.photobucket.com/albums/z313/ndrwhrnr/V1957_25-04-12.mp4" /]
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